A Canoe/Pirogue Double Paddle

[beekeeper]

Looking for a better paddle for my pirogue. I have discussed Greenland paddles and kayak paddles with narrower blades in other post. Because I usually do things different (some would say wrong) normal does not always fit. Using a double kayak paddle in a pirogue is different enough, but my boats flared sides and higher seating means the "normal" choice maybe not the best.
Pirogues in general terms are usually closer to kayak size than canoe size. Mine approaches the size of some solo canoes. I discussed double paddles with an experienced canoe paddler and he pointed out double canoe paddles are different than double kayak paddles. I also remembered that I once had lengthened a kayak paddle to nearly 9'. It worked very well in my skiff. He loaned me one of these https://bendingbranches.com/canoe-paddles/solo/slice-glass-solo/2pc . It is the 280cm length. Now I "have to go to know".

 

[Kayak Jack]

Interesting. I've paddled both kayaks and canoes with Euro style kayak paddles for over 15 years, in Michigan, Florida, Louisiana, Texas, and Canada. I've never heard of a double canoe paddle. What did your friend say are the differences between double paddles for canoes and kayaks?
I may be able to gat a new paddle from Santa!

 

[beekeeper]

It is about like comparing boat designs. When does it quite being a kayak and becomes a canoe or vise versa. The canoe paddle in general terms needs to be longer to accommodate the boat's wider beam and higher seating.
All the double paddles I have seen sold in stores are marked as "kayak" paddles. 220 to 230cm max length. Most of the charts I have seen reference beam and paddlers' height. Nothing about seat height and seldom any beam over 28".
A link about longer paddles for canoes. http://www.foxworxpaddle.com/using_double_blade_in_a_canoe.html
May not be normal way, but I will find out if it works for me.

 

[Kayak Jack]

Interesting. My experience with a 220 cm paddle (86.6") is that the steeper paddling angle is an advantage, not a disadvantage. Imparting force into the water close to the boat gives more propulsion forward, and less sideways. In simple terms - the boat goes more foreward and less sideways. Less wiggle waggle, less wasted effort, more speed, more travel. One caveat: keep your elbows lower than your shoulders.makes a paddler less susceptibility to a dislocated shoulder.

I have also observed paddlers in long canoes using single paddles. The best thing thst I can say about it is "WAKE UP"! There simply is insufficient paddle to do the job. Get a double paddle and sit in the middle of the boat.

I have a very nice wooden kayak paddle that is about a foot longer than my 220 cm paddle. Used it once, and it has hing in the garsge wall for 15 years.

I wish you good searching, good paddling, and good fishing.

 

[beekeeper]

I'm sure you have found what works for you. I may return to the paddles I am using now, but I need to know if there is something better.
What is the beam of your boat where you sit to paddle? Seat height?

 

[Kayak Jack]

Canoe beam is 30", seat height 6 3/4".
Kayak beam is 24", seat height is about -2" because my seat is below water level in a loaded boat.

 

[beekeeper]

I can see where a near vertical paddle stroke probably works best for you. Your boat is not very wide and the seat height fairly low. My boat has a 32" beam at a height of 8" and my seat is 10+" plus a cushion. The tumble home sides make the regular length paddle doable, but I think a more shallow stroke with the longer paddle may work better. Similar motion as an oar stroke.

 

[Kayak Jack]

Did you ever row with one oar at a time, alternating left and right? You'll get interesting results that are pretty much what will occur with a long, double-bladed paddle. But, in a wider boat, it may be the least-worst way to go?
You're a very good experimenter, and will work out a good solution. You might consider a steerable rudder. Then paddling on only one side is doable.

 

[oldbuffpilot]

Jack, Growing up on the river, we spent a lot of time in rowboats. Running lines, fishing, trap lines and such. I learned a a very early age to row two oars together, then when you too tired to go any more, take a break by alternating sides. we called it "paddling." We also had long and short oars. Long for distance and currents. The short we used when we needed to be close to bank like bank lines,frogging, etc.
Andy

 

[Kayak Jack]

Sounds like an interesting boyhood, Andy. Did you ever use an oar held vertically, and swish it back and forth ehile twisting it so the oar acted like a prop blade? Sculling into or away from shore, sometimes.

 

[oldbuffpilot]

We once had a product I think it was called sculleze. Worked kind's like that., but not well. I have spent many hours in the very front of a jon boat "sculling" with a paddle in one hand and a long fishing pole in the other.

 

[Kayak Jack]

You can buy - or make - a sculling paddle for one hand with slots near one end to stick fingers through, and another slot about 3/4" away, parallel, to facilitate gripping the paddle. Handy if you have a pole or rod in the other hand.
I found sculling sideways to be easier when using a single blade canoe paddle than a double ender. But, if using a double ender, a shorter one wasn't as clumsy (for me) as was a long kne.

 

[Kayak Jack]

Side note: Andy, I think that if you and I ever got together, and compared boyhoods, we would occipy a long, laugh-and-memory filled afternoon and a half. It would be very memorable.

 

[oldbuffpilot]

I suspect you are right!

 

[beekeeper]

One trip will not be enough to form many conclusions, but it tells me the paddle will work. It feels different than my shorter paddles but seems to work fine. More experience with it is needed to decide how well it works. Guess I'll have to make myself go fishing, again.

 

[Kayak Jack]

Fishing is tough duty, JD - but somebody's gotta fo it.

 

[beekeeper]

Forced myself to make a couple more fishing trips, just to test the paddle . I have not came to a final conclusion, but the paddle seems to work very well.
It appears to move the boat faster with about the same effort as my other paddles. The cadence feels different because of the longer travel stroke, and it tends to push the boat to the side more due to the stroke beginning closer to the bow.
I let bee'sboy use it and he agreed that it works well and warrants more consideration.
I will update after more testing.

 

[beekeeper]

Made a short trip yesterday and discovered another plus for the longer paddle. There were no paddle drips in the boat and more importantly, non on my legs. That is a good thing in December.

 

[oldbuffpilot]

Now I'm envious! December fishing in Louisiana, my favorite. With any luck in two weeks I'll be pulling white perch out of cypress trees. Hopefully Bistineu, Baudca, and Dorcheat. Depends on he water level.
Good Fish'n
Andy

 

[Kayak Jack]

So, Grampa JD, did you catch any fish?