This has been bothering me

[tx river rat]

First this is not to start anything but a nice civil conversation.
In one of the threads Jack quoted a guy that said ,in high winds to lower the nose of the boat
for better progress and less effect by the wind.
First if you trim nose down, it cost you paddling efficiency, second you would have to lower the nose a bunch to tell the difference in the wind , and last ,and this is the part that concerns me, trimed nose down you will be spearing the waves taking a lot more water up over the decks,high winds and waves go together, definatley not the posture you would want to be in for rough water.
These statement could get someone in trouble.

Wheee got that off my chest
Ron

 

[oldsparkey]

Ron....

Visualize this..... Calm water and the boat is loaded so the bow is slightly higher then the stern , say by 3/4 to 1 inch at the max.
Now take the same picture and lower the bow that distance so the boat is basically floating perfectly flat with the surface of the water.

The boat that is flat is what I consider a lowered bow , not having it lowered by inches but lower then what I would like it for flat water.
This way that little extra height of the bow is not sticking up or way lower then it should be, this lets it cut the wave or ride over them without being in the air and having the wind trying to push me all around. Not a lot of difference but I can tell the difference of that slight adjustment when paddling the boat.

In really bad waves of wind , stay in camp and enjoy life while being safe , it will calm down .... sometime.

In Summery............
For all round paddling I like mine to be just a shade lower in the stern then where the bow is , into the wind and waves , right about even on both ends. That is providing I have the ability to change the height of it while paddling , that is normally done when packing to leave camp.
I have been known to ask a paddler in the group to pull alongside and move a gallon water bottle from the back to the front at times and I have done that for them , to balance a boat out. One gallon water jugs makes good ballast in paddle boats.

 

[tx river rat]

Level or bow high just a tad is trimed like it should be in my mind, I get caught in bad weather some time and you just have to paddle thrue it.
Ron

 

[Kayak Jack]

In all river conditions I've paddled, I have a slight nose up trim. In almost all lake conditions I've paddled in, I also trim slightly nose up. Heading into a strong head wind on an open lake, trimming slightly nose down tends to let the bow be the pivot point instead of the stern. Heading into a wind, this tends to weather vane the tail end of a canoe. Most paddlers don't bury the bow so far as to ship water, just an inch or so below a flat trim.

It's one of those techniques you keep in the bag for certain conditions. It's a choice that an individual paddler decides to use or not.

 

[oldsparkey]

It's one of those techniques you keep in the bag for certain conditions. It's a choice that an individual paddler decides to use or not.

I take longer in explaining things then Jack does ...........
The weather , water conditions and the paddler decides which is the best and how he or she wants to do it , experience is the best teacher on how and when since they know the boat they are paddling. It's not a one size fits all sort of thing but a personal customized way for that person and boat , since all boats and paddlers are different. My way of doing it could be the worse way for you and your boat.

Ron..........
Yep , me too , been in conditions that were really nice and wham out of nowhere here comes the nasty stuff so you make the most of it and keep going especially if there is no shelter available. Started out on calm water and ended up in some roller coasters but that is called paddling and what makes it so exhilarating ( pucker factor plus 10 ) and fun.

Chuck...
PS Never believe it will be a Blue Bird Day ( great weather with the wind to your back ) out there expect the worse since it will show up at some time. OK.... Most of the time. :wink:

 

[tx river rat]

Jack
Let me get this straight in my head , you would trim your bow and inch or more down in high winds and big waves if you had the opportunity?
Is this something you have tried personally
Ron

 

[Kayak Jack]

Yes, Ron. If you are heading into the waves it is a good technique. And yes, I've had to do it several times. I advise that you not try it.

 

[tx river rat]

Jack dont worry I will heed your advice and not try it,I have mis loaded my boat a couple times nose down and I guess the water in Texas is different ,didnt work or paddle worth a dam.
Again not picking on you I just cant digest that one.
I will add this try this on calm water before you try it in a storm,
PLEASE
Ron

 

[Kayak Jack]

It probably works a lot better with a semi-rounded or vee bottomed boat. The closer to flat it is, the less the bow will become the pivot point, I think.

 

[tx river rat]

Most of my boats are v,s.
I can see one time this might make sense and that would be with a boat that had an extreme rocker.
Ron