FlaMike's Pirogue Build!

[oldyaker]

Look'n good Mike! I know what's running thru your mind as you progress... "Am I doing this right?"...."This can't ne right"..."What should I do next?"...."This looks like crap".
Than, before you know it, you have a boat and looking pretty good!
You have more nerve than I did, I was afraid to post pictures of mine for fear of exposing a sixteen foot mess! You'll have a nice looking boat soon. Keep up the good work!

 

[oldsparkey]

You could get the bottom panels joined up and leave it in place on the table. Then when the sides and ribs are in place set the frame on the bottom piece and mark it with a pencil ... cut about 2 inches outside the line ( while it is resting on the table , just slide a part of it over the edge and saw it off) which will trim the bottom down having the widest part in the middle.

This way you get rid of most of the wood you do not need and a lot of weight. Attach the sides and then trim the excess wood from the bottom , sand it flush with the sides and have it done.

As an insurance policy .........I like to epoxy fillet the inside seams before the sanding , this way if I round off to much it cuts (sands) into the fillet and does not leave a gaping hole at the junction of the side boards and the bottom. I haven't had that happen (Yet) but have come close to it.

WARNING...... When you get the sideboards together , end pieces in and the ribs then attach the out side rub rail to stiffen the boat .... if you don't then when you pick it up the sides could flex and break a rib in the boat. While you try to move it to put the bottom on.

Chuck.
PS. Jack and I are still working with Oldyaker so he can post a picture of his creation. It might be a year or two till he knows how to work his camera without having his figers over the lens. :roll:

 

[FlaMike]

oldyaker,

Thanks for the nice words!

I've been involved in a number of hobbies that have forums on the Internet dedicated to them. Too many, actually. I've been a rank beginner on most of them, sometimes working my way up to "mentor" status and forum moderator.

One thing I have learned is that one of the most valuable contributions you can make is to post your mistakes and illustrate them with pictures when possible. If you have to learn from mistakes, it's much better to learn from the mistakes of others.

This Forum has the right tone and attitude, mixed in with some very experienced and talented people who are willing to help, that makes it the perfect place for those just starting out.

I don't mind showing pictures of my efforts, even when I know they might not be up to a very high standard. Sometimes, I find out they aren't quite as bad as I thought, or at least no worse than other's early attempts.

You guys make it easy!

Mike S.
Spring Hill, FL

 

[FlaMike]

oldsparkey,

Thanks for the tips on dealing with the bottom panel, Chuck. That's the way I'll proceed when the time comes.

As I said earlier, I'm going to shoot for getting the frames ready to go between now and my next day off, which is Monday. Since I'll be getting home Monday morning around 08:00 following a 12 hour night shift, I probably won't get too much done that day.

So Tuesday is the day I hope to get the final assembly underway. Then there's the glassing to do, followed by the "little details." Stuff like the in-whale, maybe a little decking at the bow & stern, that sort of thing.

Of course, the part I really looking forward to is Launch Day. The boat will be unpainted for that. I'm going to put it in the water with a "clean bottom" and see if I feel the need for a keel/ runner, and/or inside stringers. If they aren't needed, I won't put them on. If they are, that can be done before painting.

Uncle John spent a little time cautioning me against painting over the epoxy too soon, and I've heard that here, as well.

Time for me to get back to sleep. Got to be one the job at 7, tonight.

Mike S.
Spring Hill, FL

 

[Kayak Jack]

...I was afraid to post pictures of mine for fear of exposing a sixteen foot mess! ...

I didn't know you were that tall!!

FlaMike sez: "This Forum has the right tone and attitude, mixed in with some very experienced and talented people who are willing to help, that makes it the perfect place for those just starting out." Mikey, you forgot us virulently handsome ones.

 

[oldsparkey]

This happens to a lot of the builders , they are worried about starting the project , then after they start it , that is what they think about.

FlaMike wakes up from a nap and is thinking about the boat , I bet he even thinks about it at w--k when there is some down time.

Building wood boats can be addictive , must the fun of thinking about them ,doing it , then using them.

OK.... Back to letting Mike post his build on this thread. :roll: :roll:

Chuck.

 

[FlaMike]

Unlike many who look forward to the weekends to work on their boats or get out paddling & fishing, my "weekend" begins on Mondays.

I didn't get as far with the Pirogue build as I'd liked, so I've given myself a couple of "daily goals" to meet this weekend, when I get home in the mornings. If I can meet those goals, then I will be able to catch up and have most of the work done, during my next "off" period.

So far, so good. Saturday morning, I got home are 8 in the morning. Before I toddled off to bed, I got all the lap joints cut in all the frame pieces.

Sunday morning, I'll have all the gussets cut and ready to go, might get some work done on the scarf joints for the reb rails, too.

I don't count on my first day off, Monday, as being a very productive day, since I begin it by getting home at 8 in the morning after having worked a 12 hour shift.

But, I should be able to have all the frames assembled and glued up, and the rub rails and inwhales scarfed together and ready to be installed by Monday night.

So Tuesday, I should be looking at getting the majority of the actually assembly DONE!

Wednesday and Thursday for fiberglass and epoxy, and some of the "detail work."

With any luck, I should have the boat IN the water on my first day off, the week after that.

Well, that 's the plan, anway!

Mike S.
Spring Hill, FL

 

[hairymick]

G'day Mike,

Mate, I am a 12 hour shift worker too.

I get every second week end off and lots of days off during the week.

Isn't it lovely to hit your fviourite fishing spot during the week and miss all the crowds.

I would recommend you not be in too much of a hurry. Take your time and enjoy the build. Expect a set back here and there. It is the nature of the beast and all part of the fun.

 

[cctyer]

That nasty four letter word sure is being thrown around a lot here! You know the one that begins with W and ends with retirement, hopefully! Lets try to keep it to a minimun guy's the geezzers don't like to be told of such stories of long ago!!! :lol:

 

[Kayak Jack]

Definitions of the word W*O*R*K:

Moving mass through distance
Occupation, career, or job
Nothing is w*%k, unless you'd rather be doing something else at the time.

 

[oldsparkey]

"O" Well ...:roll: Back to the subject matter..... DID you say ... PICTURES ?

Some would be nice to see on here and don't forget about the Boat Bragging section or the designer for his web site.

Chuck.

 

[FlaMike]

I haven't forgotten about the pictures!

In fact, here comes one now! The frame set, with gussets, tacked together, epoxy almost cured. There's four of them, and parts to one side for a 5th, if needed. (That's per Uncle John, he says when you widen the the design, a 5th frame in the center may be needed. Just eye-ball it and decide.)

Yes, I'm still well behind my self-imposed schedule. But that's OK, I want to get it RIGHT, more than "on time." Besides, my schedule is arbitrary anyway. I keep giving myself "deadlines" just for motivation and the fact that I want to get this boat in the water and me fishing.

But I'm not going to rush it. No need for that.

While those pieces are curing, I'm working on the scarf joints for the rub rails. That, and making a scarf joint to join a pair of Wally World canoe paddles to make a kayak paddle.

You see, I'm not sure which kind of paddle will work best for me, so I have one pair of those WalMart "cheapies" to leave as is, and another pair to turn into a kayak paddle, like I saw in a thread on this Forum. When I do decide which kind of paddle I like best, then I'll go to the paddle building forum and see about making some from scratch.

I'm going to resist the urge to assemble the hull tonight, so the glue joints on the frames and rails have time to cure overnight. So I'll occupy myself in the mean time by working on the paddle, sanding the epoxy joints on the side and bottom panels so they'll be ready for tomorrow morning, AND I think I'm going to give the stem and stern post an epoxy saturation coat, as the wood I used for those parts seem to be a little dry and not as dense as I'd like.

Another reason to not start the assembly of the hull tonight is so I can do what I said, lay all the parts out on the lawn for a "group picture" before putting it all together. All pictures I've taken and those I will take, are being saved uncropped and full size, for Uncle John. (I promised him that.)

Just wanted to get this update in, so you wouldn't think I was slacking off and doing something unproductive, like fishing!

Well, maybe I did do a little slacking off and tied up some of these. . .

The bottom 3 are redfish flys from the laflyfish web site. (Ron's Redchaser.) One standard fly, one larger version, and one standard size, unweighted for "full-stealth mode."

The 3 on top are freshwater panfish flys, because I hadn't tied any in years and really don't like using "off-the-shelf" flys. 8)

Well, enough of this! I'm going back out to the garage and get on with it.

Mike S.
Spring Hill, FL

 

[FlaMike]

Follow-up:

All task I listed above for today were completed (@ 23:30,) except for the saturation of the stem & stern post. Got to looking at it and decided it really wasn't required, after having glued up the scarf joints on the paddle and rub rails.

I laid out all the parts ready to go, mixed the epoxy, spread it on both faces of all the joints, then went back to the first one and applied a second coat and clamped that joint, then the same for the next two.

This made sure that the joints had a little time to soak up some of the epoxy, and the second application finished the job.

So, a little more sanding in the morning to clean things up and then it all goes onto the yard for a pre-assembly picture.

And then FINALLY, I get to put it all together so it will (hopefully!) look like a boat!

Mike S.
Spring Hill, FL

 

[Kayak Jack]

All task I listed above for today were completed (@ 23:30,)...

For any Marines reading this, that's when Mickey's right hand is on the 6, and his left is in between the 11 & 12.

 

[islandpiper]

KJ......I'm about to go join the Marine Reserve and make a date with you in the ring......settle down now, and remember that the Marines take the territory, the seabeas(NAVY) build the runways AND ONLY THEN does the USAF show up, land, and ask where they are billeted, and where the EMC is.

Piper

 

[FlaMike]

Since the WeatherBug has some bad things to say about working outside today, I thought I'd get the promised pictures done first.

Here's the "before" shot, looking kind of like a "kit boat."

The white-ish looking stuff on the side panels butt joints is NOT unsaturated glass tape, it's wax paper that stuck and is about to get sanded OFF. (Won't use that again.)

On the left, is the paddle made from a pair of WalMart $10 paddles. I read out this in the Paddle making Forum. Came out taller than I thought. . .

Last for now, an "almost close-up" of the scarf joint in the paddle. Not having a band saw handy, I made it with a power plane. I'm a little concerned because I just read that Gorilla Glue was recommended over epoxy in this joint, and of course, I used epoxy. But, it looks OK to me and the paddle seems to be strong, guess I'll find out when I try it out.

I called it an "almost close-up" because I almost missed it! Guess the coffee hasn't kicked in just yet.

All the parts have been moved back into the garage, just in case the WeatherBug was right! Now, I'm headed back in there myself, and see if I can commit some serious "Get 'er Done!"

Mike S.
Spring Hill, FL

 

[FlaMike]

AAAAARRRrrrrrrgggggg! :evil: :evil:

Something of a set back, I guess. . . :shock:

I was wondering if I should test-fit the side panels to the stem and stern post by attaching them first without glue, or just go ahead and epoxy them right off the bat. While thinking about this, I was preparing the ends of the panels for a good fit, using a long Sure-form rasp. (Love those things!)

When I picked up the end of one panel and stepped across it to get a better angle on it, I heard (and felt) a loud SNAP!

One side of that glass tape backed butt joint failed. It broke right over the joint, actually breaking the glass tape along the seem. I'm pretty sure that side was on the outside of the bend that I made when working on the end of the panel.

It looks to me like the other side of that joint held up. I cannot see any damage to it.

Why this happened, I'm not sure. The other side panel has been flexed as much as that one, or more, and the butt joint is fine. Also, I tested the scarf joints on the rub rails and the paddle, all good. It may be that I over-did the sanding on the joint, to smooth out some wrinkles in the epoxy from the plastic sheet I used in making the joint. I really don't know for sure.

What I've done was to lay the side panel down with the failed side up. I mixed up a batch of epoxy, lifted the panel a bit from the center to open up the cracked joint and poured epoxy right in it. I let the panel back down and applied a six inch wide piece of FG cloth over the joint and thoroughly wetted it out.

The fresh epoxy has hardened, but I don't think it is quite fully cured just yet, so I'm going to leave it alone a while longer. In the mean time, I can make the scarf joints for the in-whales, maybe get a start cutting out pieces for a pair of those seats. At least that will let me get a little ahead of the game.

Not what I wanted to be writing right now, I can tell you that much! But, it's just some "wood and epoxy," no big loss. Just some time.

I'm real glad I didn't decide to go with epoxying up the stem and stern to those pieces and then have that CRACK happen! When that side piece is ready, I'm going to attach the sides and end pieces without any glue first, just to make sure there's no more butt joint problems, before I lay on the epoxy.

Just gotta' love it when a plan comes together! (or not.) :lol:

Mike S.
Spring Hill, FL

 

[FlaMike]

OK, I think I got past that "little setback."

The re-done butt joint has now set up and looks good. Instead of the FG tape, I used about a six inch wide piece of the 6 oz. cloth. Maybe over-kill, seeing how the other butt joints made with the tape all worked well, but. . .

Anyway, here it is with the sides screwed to the stem, and getting ready to do the other end. At this time, there is no glue involved.

Both ends are now joined, but without glue. They'll get re-joined in the morning, with epoxy. Right now, the ribs are just sitting more-or-less in place. Making that last attachment was a bit of a wrestling match! I can see where a second pair of hands would have made it easier.

Only the bottom of the 5th frame is in place, since I think I'm actually going to need it, I'll have to build it tomorrow. (Maybe tonight!) This 5th frame piece is set in to give a 30" wide bottom. I was going for 32", but I think that might be just a bit too much. As much as I was looking for a little extra stability for fly fishing, the over-all shape looks better to me at 30".

Oh, and guess who forgot to bevel the frame sides before putting the frames together!!

I don't think that will turn out to be much of a "biggie." It sounds like a good job for the belt sander and bevel gauge.

At least it's kind of boat-shaped now!
I'm done with posting for tonight. 8)

Mike S.
Spring Hill, FL

 

[Kayak Jack]

Mike, your experience with the glass-backed butt joint is exactly why I use plywood on the inside, and glass the outside. When mine snapped in the shop, I knew for sure that I did NOT want to hear that sound on the water.

 

[FlaMike]

I understand that!

Since the other two butt joints did just fine, I thought I'd stay with it. While the one was being repaired, I put some serious pressure on the others. They held up.

Still not sure what went wrong with the one, over-zealous sanding still being my number one suspect. As of now, I'd use the glass cloth backed butt joint in any future builds. Only, with six inch wide cloth, instead of the 4 inch tape.

I will feel better about it once the outside is fully glassed, though. Once that's done, along with the bottom being glued to the bottom edge of the side panels, and the rails (inside & out) are attached, I'm sure the completed structure will have plenty of strength and hold up, just fine.

Well, that's my story and I'm sticking to it, anyway.

I did say I was done posting for the night, but I went ahead and built the 5th frame for a 30 inch bottom width, and now it's tomorrow!

Mike S.
Spring Hill, FL